A Little Bit Richer

James: This series is brought to you by L&G, helping you build a future that's a little bit richer. 
 
Iona Bain: Hello and welcome to A Little Bit Richer with me, Iona Bain, brought to you by Legal & General. We all know how important saving money is. It gets us out of living paycheque to paycheque check. It sets good habits and it protects our future. But it's often easier said than done. And as we've come to the last payday before Christmas, maybe you're fretting about all those festive outgoings and you're looking ahead to January and maybe some New Year's resolutions. Well, you might be wondering how can I save when I'm spending so much, or I know I should be saving, but what are some hacks to get started? 
So today I'm joined by friend of the show Laura Ann Moore. Laura is a certified financial coach, financial wellbeing speaker and host of the Mind Money Soul podcast. She's on a mission to get you financially confident and take control of your future. And having saved over £40,000 by the time she was 27, she is the perfect person for us to chat to today about staying motivated with saving. 
Welcome, Laura. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: Thank you for having me back. 
 
Iona Bain: Well, it's lovely for you to come back. So how can people make saving feel more real and achievable in their day- to- day lives rather than it feeling like a long- term distant goal? What are some good habits for long- term saving? 
 
Laura Ann Moore: I think the key thing is to think about sustainability and not be super extreme about it. I always talk about this link between money and fitness. So if we think about it, you want to get your summer bod for next year. If you go full swing and you go, " Right, I'm cutting out carbs, I'm cutting out sugar, I'm cutting out alcohol and all the fun stuff," that works for what, five, 10 days? And at some point that restrictiveness makes you want to go the other way. It makes you want to binge on all of those things. It wants you to just throw the baby out with the bath water and just go, "Ah," go crazy.

So applying an attitude when it comes to fitness of the 80/20 rule. Most of the time you eat well, you exercise well, and then you have the little treats. It's the same with saving, I think, is finding a way to be more sustainable day- to- day, saving little and often. And I think the reason why some people find that hard is the mindset of it feeling boring. But it can be boring sometimes, but you can gamify it obviously. And I think that starting small and working towards a goal is better than waiting for the right moment to hit. I think sometimes we fall into a trap of being like, " I don't really know what I want to save for, I don't really have that big of a goal," but you're never going to regret having money saved. 
 
Iona Bain: Yeah. Do you find that people will often say to you, " Well, I'll save once I've achieved this or I've achieved that"? And what's your response to them? 
 
Laura Ann Moore: Yeah, I think it's one of those things where you don't have to be saving all of the time, but I think you don't want to be in a position where you look back and you're like, " I've lost out on all that time when I could have been doing some of the little things that would've added up." So it's more a reframe in mindset towards what saving looks like for you and how you can work it into your day- to- day in a way that feels good and not miss out. 
 
Iona Bain: Absolutely. So let's get into that. What does it take to create that mindset? Just talk us through how we can be more intentional with putting money away. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: So I think it's so easy to fall into a mindset of saying things like, " I'm a spender, I'm not a saver." Even if that is objectively true because you have been spending more than you've been saving, that phrase, the way that you speak about yourself, the way that you speak about your money has a massive impact on how you behave. 
 
Iona Bain: Yeah. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: So first off, just noticing, like what are the things that I say to my friends, to my partner, to myself around my savings habits, and are they helping me or are they hindering me? It requires a bit of honesty I think, which can be hard. But just acknowledging, okay, if I keep saying I'm a spender, guess what's going to happen? I'm going to keep spending. So shifting your language is a really great place to start because that will help essentially train your brain that you are capable of that thing.

So for example, if you were to save £ 5 a week, no, it's probably not the amount of money that you're going to want to buy a house very quickly, but it shows that you're building the habit. It gives your brain evidence. And you can say confidently, " I'm a saver." It builds the foundation for you to use your words in a positive way. And then the two kind of support each other. I think that really helps for changing your mindset towards saving. 
 
Iona Bain: And do you find that people will often adjust their spending once they get a pay rise, then they think, " Hey, I'm at that point where I'm earning decent money, therefore I'm going to enjoy myself"? How do you try to combat that and still have a little bit of a savings mindset going on there whilst still enjoying yourself? 
 
Laura Ann Moore: I'm a big believer you can do both, but sometimes the weight's going to be different. But lifestyle creep, it's so easy. You end up spending on a slightly more expensive bottle of water, then you go to a slightly nicer restaurant, slightly nicer clothes. So it's when suddenly you've got more income each month. But instead of being strategic and saying, " Okay, a percentage of that will be saved and invested and a percentage of that will be spent and enjoyed." It's easy to fall into the habit of just spending it because it's there. And that's why I think having a budget and a spending plan is so useful for your financial success because it allows you to understand where that money is going. I always say it's okay to treat yourself a bit, but make sure you just give that extra money direction. Because so many people look back over years and years of having pay rises and they're like, " I don't really know what I've got to show for it," because you just inflate your lifestyle to meet it. 
 
Iona Bain: And so you can see why people definitely get into that mindset, but then it must really, really affect their ability to save in the long run. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: Yeah, definitely. Because not only are you getting used to that nicer lifestyle, even if it's only the mini luxuries- 
 
Iona Bain: They all add up. But most importantly, being conscious of where that extra money is going at. And also habits. I imagine that's a really important cornerstone of saving. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: Yes. And I think the habit of saving is when you get used to it and it's just a part of your life and it becomes a non- negotiable, you're not having to convince yourself to save or persuade yourself or motivate, it's just part of it. I think there are things that you can do, like automating your finances. So the day that you get paid, having an automation, like a direct debit or a standing order that moves money into savings straight away can be great, because it removes the emotion. But just really understanding what does that habit look like for me. And I love habit stacking. 
 
Iona Bain: So habit stacking is when you're just throwing all these different habits in together and that way you're killing lots of birds with one stone. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: It's using your brain basically to trick yourself into knowing what comes next and just doing it without needing to use your willpower. For example, on payday, every time I move money into my spending account, I also move money into my savings. Or every time I spend on something, I also move it into savings. And you stack it onto another habit. It helps it not feel like a drag, like, " Oh, I've still got to do this thing." I learned about habits stacking from the James Clear book, Atomic Habits. He believes in marginal gains. So 1% better every day compounds massively. The same can be applied to money. But when you apply it to your habits, it doesn't feel so overwhelming. If all you have to do is have one new habit, do that for a couple of weeks, then it's embedded, introduce a new one, and it rolls on. And then it just becomes a part of your lifestyle. You can do that with saving. 
 
Iona Bain: Right. So rather than trying to do it all at once, you got to start slow and build it up over time. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: Yeah. And meet yourself where you're at. So if you're even struggling to budget right now or even have a spending plan, start there. Don't think that you go there and then next minute, no, you need to have £20,000 in saving. 
 
Iona Bain: Because I'm a big fan of talking about saving as a way to give yourself options and freedom further down the line. And what you mentioned before about setting up a standing order to your savings account when you're paid, that's like paying your future self first. Is that something that you encourage people to think about? 
 
Laura Ann Moore: When I talk about budgeting and having a spending plan now, I talk about the three S's, which is money for survival, so living cost, money for spending, which is the fun stuff, and money for success. Savings falls into success, because when I had the £ 15,000 when I was younger and I ended up very last minute going traveling, that was my moment of money gives you choice and freedom. Had I not had that money, I couldn't have taken that opportunity. And giving yourself those little moments to go, oh, I see how money can be a tool, I see how when I'm good with my money or I build a good habit and I'm saving and I'm enjoying the process, the consequence of that is also positive. 
 
Iona Bain: It's self- care. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: A hundred percent. 
 
Iona Bain: So what are some fun ways to trick your brain into saving more? 
 
Laura Ann Moore: There are three main ways, I think. So I'm not a massive fan of no- spend months. 
 
Iona Bain: Yeah, that feels very restrictive. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: So restrictive. Where's the fun? 
 
Iona Bain: No. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: But no- spend zones would be, okay, where are my biggest triggers with overspending? Where do I spend when I look back and go, " Oh, really wish I hadn't done that"? They're the places that you would put a bit more of a rule around. For example, if your weakness is after work, tired, can't be arsed to cook, you know you're going to be getting a Deliveroo. But then afterwards you're like, " Oh, I could have probably even made that for half the price."

Iona Bain: Yeah, yeah. 
  
Laura Ann Moore: So if you know that's your trigger, you would say, " Okay, I'm going to maybe do no deliveries during the week." Or you can step foot outside in London and before you know it, you've spent £100. So maybe you say, " Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, I don't spend before 12 PM." Just zones of the day of the week where you just make an active choice to not spend as much, therefore allowing you to save a bit more. So that'd be one.

The second one is what I like to call buy one, save one. So if you are going to buy something and you have to then say, " Okay, whatever I've spent on this item, I will also put the same amount into savings." So it kind of is like the concept of only buy it if you can afford to buy it twice. And I think that that creates awareness around how much you're spending, if you can afford it, if it fits into your budget right now. And it's not to say you can't ever have that thing, it just brings awareness to the moment.

And then the third one is the three week rule. So every time you go to spend money on something that is a non- essential, it's something a bit more fun, spontaneous, maybe a bit more luxurious, you write it down in the notes in your phone, what it is, how much it was. You could even add in the emotion that you were feeling, if you want. Make it a bit like a diary. And then after the first three weeks of the month, you wait till the last week, and you go back over that list. First off, what actually do I still want? A lot of them you'll be like, " Definitely don't need that fifth pair of the same type of trainer." 
 
Iona Bain: Yeah. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: But if you look at that and go, " Okay, I've got a little bit money left over my budget, I am still going to buy that thing." So it's not that you're fully restricting yourself, you're just waiting till later on in the month. Also, if you add up all of that money that you would've spent, look at it and you go, " That's technically how much I've saved, because I've not spent that money." 
 
Iona Bain: Yeah. That's a really good point. And I think a lot of this is about putting friction back in your finances because it's just too easy to spend now. With cash dying out, with us all tapping our cards, with us spending online, one- click payments, these are all methods that are geared towards us spending more. And so it's I think down to us as individuals to just put those speed bumps back in our finances. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: Yeah. And with the age of social media, I think it's so easy to look at everybody else living what looks like a dream life and be like, "Well, I want that now." And I think learning the art of delayed gratification goes hand- in- hand with learning how to save, that you can't uncouple them. And the more that you're able to learn how to enjoy and create delayed gratification, I genuinely think the happier you are long term in life and also financially happy. 
 
Iona Bain: Yes, I couldn't agree more. So can you talk about some of the features on banking apps that might make it a little bit easier to do all of this? 
 
Laura Ann Moore: I like being able to have in a bank account on your phone different pots that you can name, that you can emotionally attach to your goal, but then using the AI part, which is roundups. So when you're spending money, let's say it was £ 11.59 and it rounds it up to £ 12, and that extra 41 p goes in a little pot. It might not seem like a lot, but over the course of a month of spending, it can add up and it can just be a nice little savings pot that is so useful. 
 
Iona Bain: And also giving those pots nice names. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: Yes. Because when you see the name of that, it says holiday fund, or wherever you're off to, Ibiza fund, or you really want a new car, if you are one of those people that is more likely to dip into your savings once you've done it, when you go to that pot and it says, you can ask yourself, " Okay, this money that I'm about to take out, is that, A, taking me closer towards my goal or further away from it, but also, what am I taking from my future self?" That is a meal on holiday. 
 
Iona Bain: Yeah, that is one less cocktail in Ibiza. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: YEA. 
 
Iona Bain: You do not want to deprive yourself of that. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: You don't want to deprive yourself of that. Keep that money in there. It brings awareness to that moment, but it creates that connection between what that future version of yourself is using that money for. And that kind of taps into the sort of neuroscience part of your brain, which is allowing you to visualize and create emotion. And therefore, if the behaviour comes from the emotion, if you see, " Oh, I'm taking from something that's going to be really fun ..." And let's use coffee, for example. I love coffee. However, I would happily cut back on a couple of coffees to save for that because I do that every day. So I'm like, " Oh, that's okay. This is more exciting for me." And it can come back after, once I've saved. 
 
Iona Bain: Yes. Good point. Let's come on to how you can save money whilst you're shopping. Is there any ways that you can start to build up that cash even whilst you're spending? 
 
Laura Ann Moore: Definitely. So number one being cash back. So I think people get a little bit confused by cash back because they're like, " What's the catch?" But essentially it's different websites where if you're planning to spend online anyway, especially coming up to Christmas, you're going to be buying those gifts if you use a cash back site first ... So you go to the website, write in the retailer, click on it, it directs you there. You spend money as you'd planned, so either a percentage or a set fee, you were already going to spend that money, so why not get a little bit of kickback? Also, I'm a big fan of just searching for discount codes. The amount of vouchers and discount codes you can find when you're shopping online just by typing in retailer discount code, it's crazy. So therefore you're actually saving money itself on the purchase. 
 
Iona Bain: Yeah. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: And then I think looking at the areas of your life where you already spend money and being able to look at, okay, well where could I save with this? So for example, if you love shopping for clothes, and first of all, can you sell your own clothes and make some money back on Vinted, and then utilize that money within Vinted, which is a second-hand online store, to buy new clothes? So it's kind of like you're not really losing or gaining anything. It's kind of more like swapping. 
 
Iona Bain: Yeah, you're keeping your money within that platform and therefore it's not really coming out of your bank account. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: Exactly. Especially with fast fashion. It's a way of looking after the environment, looking after your own bank account. Another one is if you're wanting to save a bit of money while you spend with groceries, planning is one of the best ways to help save money when you're spending. Planning ahead, for the week for your dinners, taking lunch in instead of eating lunch out, all things like that. 
 
Iona Bain: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, Laura, I could talk to you about this all day long, but if I had to whittle you down to three tips for staying motivated while saving for the long term, what would they be? 
 
Laura Ann Moore: I think number one would be tracking your progress. It's really important to make sure you know where you're headed and how you're doing. Even if you feel like your progress isn't going as quick or as easy as you want, that is all data. What is working, what's not? Where can I be better? What's tripping me up? All of those little things is just data to do a better job for the next month. Number two is celebrating your milestones. So if you have this big goal, I want to save £ 20,000 for a house deposit, but right now you have £ 100, that feels overwhelming. That is like, what's the point? How do I even get started? So being able to see the staircase, a little celebration when I hit my £ 1, 000. Obviously you don't spend the thousand and undo all of that work. But a little treat, something that feels rewarding to be able to do that. And I definitely think using visual aids is really, really useful. 
 
Iona Bain: Oh, I'm such a visual person, so that really works for me. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: Massively. And colouring it in, stickers, anything that's very childlike and playful brings just a little bit of joy to it. And it actually turns on a little bit in the brain, which is the dopamine. It makes it exciting. That's why, you know when you have a to- do list and you do something that's not on the list, so you add it to the list so you can tick it off? I do that all- 
 
Iona Bain: I do that all the time. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: There's something in the brain that it makes you feel good, it makes you feel accomplished. So doing the same thing with your savings, it makes you more connected to it. And I think it just makes the whole thing more enjoyable. 
And the third tip would be having the mindset of a saver. So knowing that you see yourself as a saver, you speak about your savings in a positive way, and that you believe in your own abilities to save. I'm a big believer of being like, no one's coming to save you. It's on you. And that can help you feel so proud. The sense of achievement when you reach your own goals and you've done it is just like nothing else. But you have to have that belief in yourself first. Even if up until this point you've always struggled, use this as like a catalytic moment to wipe the slate clean and say, " It doesn't matter what's happened up until this point, I'm resetting. I know that I can do it. And I'll start small and I'll build it up and I'll build that confidence and trust with myself so that I am a saver." 
 
Iona Bain: Everyone at home is like, " Yes, I can do this." 
 
Laura Ann Moore: Yeah. 
 
Iona Bain: So galvanizing and inspiring. Thank you so much, Laura. 
 
Laura Ann Moore: Thank you for having me. 
 
Iona Bain: Honestly, so many great tips on how we can gamify our savings there and set good habits for the future. If this episode has sparked some inspiration for saving, I would love it if you could share the podcast and help others get a little bit richer too. This podcast is brought to you by L&G. You can keep up with the show on YouTube, TikTok and Instagram at Legal & General. And before I go, I just want to say, if you've got a question or a topic that you'd like answered on the show, we would really love to hear from you. So please do get in touch on our socials. Until next time, see you soon.